What if this isn't purely psychological, isn't pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

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JakeLawe
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by JakeLawe »

Shamanana wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 5:31 am I wonder why its hard to imagine that drugs that are literally used for chemical castration might cause persistent issues for some.
Sources? last time I read they use something else precisely because the ssri isn't long lasting for this purpose, the convicts get it reversed.. even so if i remember correctly they need to give them INDUSTRIAL amounts for it to even work for this purpose to a subtle degree. So even if this was true which I have my doubts It'll be/was eversible in 100% of cases.

Furthermore: You think is really true? so SSRIs are given for chemical castration reliably? then millions would be chemically castrated by now no? certainly it'd be on the news. Some of these sources can be sketchy. I think they use hormone related injections rather than SSRIs.

Furthermore: SSRIs aren't the only substances known to be linked to this phenomenon. So they could give convicts Saw Palmetto, Finasteride, Accutane too..but they don't and they don't ssris either because neither is reliable as a chemical castration substance.

Now, I know you'll post your pdfs, I've seen em too but I stand to what I'm saying. SSRIs are not a good choice for chemical castration because 1.- it just doesn't work 2.- it's reversible. and again it'd have to be injected or something in industrial ammounts for them to even start acting as such if at all.

These pills are given to millions.. you saying the government knows these are used for chemical castration too? it's all too sketchy to me.. specially since people recover sooner or later, there was evidently no damage or not one that isn't healed.
Last edited by JakeLawe on Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by JakeLawe »

Shamanana wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 5:31 am I wonder why its hard to imagine that drugs that are literally used for chemical castration might cause persistent issues for some.
I wonder why it's hard to imagine that the sexual energy can't be destroyed, nor the depressive energy they can only be transformed. Why it's hard to imagine a conversion disorder triggered by the ingestion of the pills and prolonged by the mind as a self mechanism against depression.
JakeLawe
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by JakeLawe »

What if this ISN'T purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms but something else? WHAT THEN? What would be the method of reversing things then?
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guacamo
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by guacamo »

JakeLawe wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:35 pm
Shamanana wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 5:31 am I wonder why its hard to imagine that drugs that are literally used for chemical castration might cause persistent issues for some.
I wonder why it's hard to imagine that the sexual energy can't be destroyed, nor the depressive energy they can only be transformed. Why it's hard to imagine a conversion disorder triggered by the ingestion of the pills and prolonged by the mind as a self mechanism against depression.
How would you explain otherwise healthy person to detoriate after taking medicine and never go back to the normal state after quiting? If that would be mental why people are helped by certain substances, their symptoms can subside 100% for few days, then go back to the usual PSSD state? Some or most of the people here did not need to be taken to SSRI in the first place. They are overprescribed, because scared psychiatrists are afraid to let go their patients without prescription and medical scheme is to always start with SSRI and then see what happens. There is no discussion of potential side effects or dialogue about what would patient prefer based on side effects of the drug. I bet no one on this forum was adviced that SSRI produce sexual symptoms during taking even not related to PSSD. This sort of thinking that PSSD is some sort of transformation of energy in the mind is on the level of saying that we really live life only in a dream and waking up is fake life. It is baseless, relies on no data, is against evidence and common sense. PSSD in etiology is biomolecular and is in competency of neurobiology. I and i can guess many more on this forum no more have the symptoms that we tried to cure by SSRIs in the first place. I am healthy with or without pssd i have no more worries than normal person, what does resonate in me roughly speaking is blunted affect started by SSRIs and it did not subside upon quiting. Can not express it more directly. Every sensation you ever felt, feel and will feel in the future starts and ends within the brain. It is a matter of amount of neurons, amount of receptor expressions, their type, sensitivity to the ligand, enzymatic exchanges that take place within the cell. Sexuality is no hermit in this case. You can click certain things in the brain and make genius a retard, hypersexual to asexual, high achiever to lazy netflix binger. We on this forum do not concern ourselfes with all of this, because trying to unravell all of this lies above our and current science competency. However we do concern ourselfes with the genesis and etiopatology of PSSD because everyone firmly believes it can be cured, based also on recovery cases presented all over the internet. It is foremost task and mission for everyone that ever visited this forum. Finding dots between certain mechanism of recovery stories is why this forum does not cease to exist. Relying on psychology that does not provide equations but only baseless assumptions and predictions of behavior is in this case pointless and it is nothing but a waste of time.
JakeLawe
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by JakeLawe »

guacamo wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 12:11 am
JakeLawe wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:35 pm
Shamanana wrote: Mon Jun 28, 2021 5:31 am I wonder why its hard to imagine that drugs that are literally used for chemical castration might cause persistent issues for some.
I wonder why it's hard to imagine that the sexual energy can't be destroyed, nor the depressive energy they can only be transformed. Why it's hard to imagine a conversion disorder triggered by the ingestion of the pills and prolonged by the mind as a self mechanism against depression.
How would you explain otherwise healthy person to detoriate after taking medicine and never go back to the normal state after quiting? If that would be mental why people are helped by certain substances, their symptoms can subside 100% for few days, then go back to the usual PSSD state? Some or most of the people here did not need to be taken to SSRI in the first place. They are overprescribed, because scared psychiatrists are afraid to let go their patients without prescription and medical scheme is to always start with SSRI and then see what happens. There is no discussion of potential side effects or dialogue about what would patient prefer based on side effects of the drug. I bet no one on this forum was adviced that SSRI produce sexual symptoms during taking even not related to PSSD. This sort of thinking that PSSD is some sort of transformation of energy in the mind is on the level of saying that we really live life only in a dream and waking up is fake life. It is baseless, relies on no data, is against evidence and common sense. PSSD in etiology is biomolecular and is in competency of neurobiology. I and i can guess many more on this forum no more have the symptoms that we tried to cure by SSRIs in the first place. I am healthy with or without pssd i have no more worries than normal person, what does resonate in me roughly speaking is blunted affect started by SSRIs and it did not subside upon quiting. Can not express it more directly. Every sensation you ever felt, feel and will feel in the future starts and ends within the brain. It is a matter of amount of neurons, amount of receptor expressions, their type, sensitivity to the ligand, enzymatic exchanges that take place within the cell. Sexuality is no hermit in this case. You can click certain things in the brain and make genius a retard, hypersexual to asexual, high achiever to lazy netflix binger. We on this forum do not concern ourselfes with all of this, because trying to unravell all of this lies above our and current science competency. However we do concern ourselfes with the genesis and etiopatology of PSSD because everyone firmly believes it can be cured, based also on recovery cases presented all over the internet. It is foremost task and mission for everyone that ever visited this forum. Finding dots between certain mechanism of recovery stories is why this forum does not cease to exist. Relying on psychology that does not provide equations but only baseless assumptions and predictions of behavior is in this case pointless and it is nothing but a waste of time.
Ok, look. First of all, use paragraphs. It was a chore reading or attempting to read all that without. Certainly you know the way the brain prefers to read if there's resting spaces no?

Second: nobody here or anywhere knows what's going on. I don't, you don't, the very chemists that came with sertraline and are already dead don't, but even if they were alive they wouldn't know.

I agree patients should be warned of potential phenomenons linked to ingestion before hand. it's meant life is and death for many, but it's a barbaric world at times, nothing short of the middle ages regarding the rights of patients. The illusion that there's "experts" behind society may be but that, an illusion. Is just people as confused as we are and some assholes in between. Our "crime" was to trust on said experts. But trust in itself is what we need now.

Some people DO go back to normal, some of us do. so i disagree with your very first statement.

Now, I don't know 100% what's going on either. I'm asking questions and joining dots as best I can but to answer your question with the hypothesis I subscribe the most:

People would be helped with certain substances because 1.- could be placebo. 2.- the substance has actual antidepressive/anxiolitic properties that therefore provide relief in both: mental and physical symptoms

They then "go back to pssd" because depression is hard to treat, the substance stops working.. also a conversion disorder is also hard to, can take years. also people can be hysterics, saying broccoli crashed them etc.. it's a sort of hypochondria or that precisely. Mind-body relationship is backed by science. People could be going through a great time in their lives or a rather unpleasant one, that's also bound to have an impact.

I don't agree with many things you say but for the sake of topic I'll leave it like that. Is this psychosomatic? is this purely physical/"mechanical"? combination? I've no idea.

There's at least one guy that got a numb dick and he didn't take anything at all... now, conversion disorders usually involve more dramatic symptoms but numbness is among them.

Energy ain't destroyed. The depressive energy went somewhere.. my take? to one's dick. am I 100% sure of this? no. of course not.

My treatment for everyone is: keep treating your mental health by all means necessary, therapy, exercise, diet, supplements, medicine, change of lifestyle, change of attitude, change of personality, change of identity, new girlfriend, new job, new city, a cat, learn to Love, be grateful, fake it til you make it, cry, laugh as possible, etc, whatever.. THEN.. IF this is somatic and there's no more depression.. then one's dick will be freed, one's physical health will follow.

Alternatively the depression could fully go back to the mind too but I think the former approach is overall better.

On this hypothesis, I am by no means saying the ingestion of the ssri was coincidence for the somatization.. that's no coincidence.. we're conditioned to think the pill will do something.. and it may, actually.. but I'm thinking the mind takes the opportunity to relieve itself by transferring some of that energy to one's genitals.. so the pill started it but is one's mind prolonging it. The location and nature of the symptom may also be our own body/mind telling us something, it's no coincidence either, perhaps some rather unhealthy habits need change.

Of course maybe is something else. Either way the treatment seems the same to me: Have a good time as possible and regret not a thing as possible and be grateful even under torture and while living a nightmare as possible. Make a nightmare a beautiful nightmare as possible.

Again, we come to this forum for several reasons. And I'm still experiencing a numb dick but maybe I don't care anymore.

We've no choice but to keep questioning of course. We're the experts regarding this phenomenon after all..
Last edited by JakeLawe on Tue Jul 06, 2021 5:04 pm, edited 8 times in total.
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guacamo
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by guacamo »

JakeLawe wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:35 pm"Energy ain't destroyed. The depressive energy went somewhere.. my take? to one's dick"
I think that further discussion is pointless.
JakeLawe
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by JakeLawe »

guacamo wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 4:05 pm
JakeLawe wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:35 pm"Energy ain't destroyed. The depressive energy went somewhere.. my take? to one's dick"
I think that further discussion is pointless.
Hey, im explaining to you what a conversion disorder basically is but whatever. They actually changed the name to functional neurological disorder. It's basically that. A manifestation of depression/anxiety/stress/trauma/hysteria as a physical symptom that can be short or long lasting, depending. Triggered by? many things.. an antidepressant/placebo pill? I'd say possibly!

Maybe it's pointless for me too, but I'm leaving my post for anyone interested on this perspective.

Also: you asked. I ain't interested in arguing either, though always open for discussion if you change your mind. I could say it's pointless to me because I disagree the brain is the beginning and end of all experience, actually, but I rolled with it for the sake of discussion but if you won't do the same, well.. I'll live ;).

A survey in, let's say reddit, where more people participate, will show you quite a few people claim being less depressed/anxious to some degree in spite of the symptom, as long as the symptom ain't that bad I Imagine, but seems to me that the lessening of mental burden seems to be in proportion to the physical symptom(s).

Anyway as I said, I'm not 100% sure what's going on or what's not going on.

Don't forget paragraphs!
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by GIXXER »

JakeLawe why are you here?

Are you trying to convince us that what we're experiencing isnt real, that its psychological ?
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guacamo
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by guacamo »

Functional neurological disorder discplaced conversion disorder in DSM-5, but they do not not share the same definition.
Your theory about energy not being destroyed can be posted in forum related to physics, altough if u have in mind such a visit i can provide you with short cut - law of conservation of energy can only be aplied locally.
Conversion disorder is just another term for idiopatic disease, known as " we have no idea why you feel that way". Disease cannot not have physical etiology. The fact that they do them MRI or SPECT scan and find nothing wrong does not mean that everything is okey and it all lies in their psychology. These scans do not have omnipotent properties and are effective mostly in diagnozing TMI, and neurodegenerative diseases. Your hypothalamus might give you wrong feedback about temperature but no brain scanning machine in the world will find it.
If we reduce PSSD and are ignorant to neurobiological causes, we can just close this forum and move on, believing that unexplainable fenomena caused the energy of our depression to be manifested in our penises.
Regarding the disagreement between us about the genesis of the experience - i stand by philosophical materialism, you i guess some sort of transcententalism, maybe without religious parts. There are fundamental differences between them, that's why we will never come to mutual conclusion.
Last edited by guacamo on Tue Jul 06, 2021 5:25 pm, edited 2 times in total.
JakeLawe
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Re: What if this is purely psychological, pure hysteria converted into physical symptoms?

Unread post by JakeLawe »

GIXXER wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 5:02 pm JakeLawe why are you here?

Are you trying to convince us that what we're experiencing isnt real, that its psychological ?
There's no "Why" except in the imagination. Why is anyone here? specially since there seems to be no answers at all and most posts are depressive as hell!

I ain't "trying" anything, let alone "trying to convince" anyone, not even myself.

This thread is a perspective.. "What if.. " and somewhere I also typed a "What if ISN'T" buy nobody seemed to have payed attention to that one.

Oh, dude I know by experience my dick is not as before and that's real. I've never said the symptoms aren't real. They're as real as thoughts!

Conversion disorder are painful precisely because the patient ain't faking or imagining the symptoms.

As I said I don't know 100% what's going on or not.
Last edited by JakeLawe on Tue Jul 06, 2021 5:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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