Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Thomas
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Tree wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:58 am
Thomas wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:23 am I don't challenge this theory (or others). I just say "permanent" desensitization with agonists was not proven in vivo (to my knowledge).
Long term ssri use has been shown to decouple girk channels causing receptor desensitization. Pretty sure agonists do too but not sure if decoupling causes permanent receptor desensitization.
That is exactly my point. It has been proven with SSRIs, not with agonists. I am not sure the opposite was proven, though.
Escitalopram, 10mg/day, Jan-May 2019. Fluoxetine, May-Sept 2019. Mirtazapine, November 2019-January 2020. Escitalopram, Feb-May 2020.
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Tree
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Thomas wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 5:06 am
Tree wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:58 am
Thomas wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:23 am I don't challenge this theory (or others). I just say "permanent" desensitization with agonists was not proven in vivo (to my knowledge).
Long term ssri use has been shown to decouple girk channels causing receptor desensitization. Pretty sure agonists do too but not sure if decoupling causes permanent receptor desensitization.
That is exactly my point. It has been proven with SSRIs, not with agonists. I am not sure the opposite was proven, though.
I've been doing some research on receptor internalization. Both chronic ssri and agonist use can internalize the receptor into the cell. We are probably suffering from internalization and for some reason receptors don't normalize after drug withdrawal.
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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I would like to report that hydrocortisone in both pill and cream form made me crash. I had to take the pills for dermatitis I'd contracted at the beginning of winter and the cream for my psoriasis in addition to a nasty case of haemorrhoids. All three times I felt derealised and my brain fog worsened considerably. When I had to take the lattermost application as a suppository, it made me feel like I was going into a coma after eight days' worth of treatment. Very disconcerting to state the least - I've experienced more atrophy and brain fog has deteriorated my short-term memory and attention span to nearly nothing.
2010~2012: Prozac, Concerta, Wellbutrin (no effects)
2012~2018: Effexor with 150 mg being typical dose. Weaned off March, reinstatement in June, abrupt cessation in September.
Severe ED, less ejaculate, definitive shrinkage, lack of libido, anhedonia.
Thomas
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Meso wrote: Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:10 pm Here's a list of the worst offenders when it comes to PSSD.

Antidepressants:
It goes without saying to avoid any antidepressant that inhibits SERT function (i.e. Certain tricyclic antidepressants, SSRIs, Trazodone, Vortioxetine ... etc) or messes with neurosteroids (i.e. Mirtazapine). There are reports of post-AD syndromes similar to PSSD from that.
Could you please elaborate a bit about mirtazapine? It looks like the perfect antidepressant for us (its worst side-effect, drowsiness, is rather a benefits for us suffering from insomnia).
On the opposite, SJW has a SSRI effect (amongst many), so it seems more risky to me.
Escitalopram, 10mg/day, Jan-May 2019. Fluoxetine, May-Sept 2019. Mirtazapine, November 2019-January 2020. Escitalopram, Feb-May 2020.
Symptoms: low libido | sexual numbness | insomnia
Thomas
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Tree wrote: Fri Jan 29, 2021 10:10 pm I've been doing some research on receptor internalization. Both chronic ssri and agonist use can internalize the receptor into the cell. We are probably suffering from internalization and for some reason receptors don't normalize after drug withdrawal.
Please share any interesting research paper you found / wrote.
Escitalopram, 10mg/day, Jan-May 2019. Fluoxetine, May-Sept 2019. Mirtazapine, November 2019-January 2020. Escitalopram, Feb-May 2020.
Symptoms: low libido | sexual numbness | insomnia
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Meso
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Receptor internalization is the step preceeding receptor downregulation. First, receptors are internalized upon exposure to an agonist. Afterwards, the receptors are removed altogether (downregulation). You can think of internalization as the first step in downregulation.
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frhfu398hhf9hf3hf8
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Meso wrote: Mon Feb 08, 2021 9:51 pm Afterwards, the receptors are removed altogether
So is that an irreversible process?
Intro || Fluoxetine for 2 weeks in October 2020
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Meso
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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frhfu398hhf9hf3hf8 wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 3:05 am So is that an irreversible process?
No, it's reversible. The receptors can be synthesized again once the excessive stimulus is gone.
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Tree
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Meso wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 3:17 am
frhfu398hhf9hf3hf8 wrote: Tue Feb 09, 2021 3:05 am So is that an irreversible process?
No, it's reversible. The receptors can be synthesized again once the excessive stimulus is gone.
These drugs (ssri's) must have permanently down regulated sert somehow. This is keeping 5ht1a receptors desensitized. I wouldn't have crashed from ginger if I never took an ssri for three years. The crash was induced by a build up of serotonin in my system, which desensitized 5ht1a receptors even further. I ate an inch of raw ginger root for around 8 days until, one day from the next, I crashed. Literally that day/night when I crashed, I had extreme, abnormal symptoms, such as uncontrollable panic attacks, agitation, nausea, and increase body temperature. Those are all obvious signs of serotonin poisoning. If I had a functional sert, serotonin levels would have not elevated that high. We need to study how sert proteins have changed from long term ssri use and develop a drug that reverses this change.
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Meso
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Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

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Tree wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:48 pm We need to study how sert proteins have changed from long term ssri use and develop a drug that reverses this change.
There are already some studies showing that SSRI use downregulates SERT gene expression, especially in male patients.
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